Episode 27

Live From the Mid-America Trucking Show! The Future of the Driver Experience

with Adam Vazquez and Carlton Riffel

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Highlights from the conversation:

  • MATS and why we were there (1:50)
  • The gap between truckers and technology (6:04)
  • Problems we observed: mistrust, siloed solutions, short term thinking (12:11)
  • Interesting solutions we observed (18:11)
  • Broader takeaways (26:30)
  • The trip’s great mystery (31:07)

 

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Transcription

Transcription generated by Otter.ai

Adam Vazquez 0:06
All right, on this episode of Content Is for Closers, we have a very special episode. I’m wearing my “suns out, guns out” shirt. If you’re not watching on YouTube you’re missing out. The reason for all of that is— I got my dream team hat on. The reason for that is that Carlton and I just got back from the Mid-America Trucking Show in Louisville, Kentucky. We’re going to tell you everything we saw, everything we heard (there were some crazy things we saw and heard), and most importantly, the takeaways that we learned. Let’s get into it.

Adam Vazquez 1:00
We’re recording. Carlton, thank you for surviving the journey to Louisville with me. Thank you for going.

Carlton Riffel 1:08
Talking about surviving, Adam, you’re the one that survived. Adam was on death’s doorstep with a sinus infection.

Adam Vazquez 1:16
We actually, full disclosure, we recorded an episode in Louisville— at Louisville, whatever that city is called. It was a bad week for me all around. We’ll get into some details of it, but nothing worked out for me, including the fact that I was pretty sick. Carlton took one glance at the video and was like, “Oh, yeah. We can’t use this. You look horrendous.” So I’m wearing this.

Carlton Riffel 1:39
The content was good, it was just people would have written in and just stopped the video out of concern for your health.

Adam Vazquez 1:47
Yeah, it was a rough look, but we did make it. So we were there for the Mid-America Trucking Show, which is one of (if not, the biggest) trucking show in the country. Some of the details, I think they said there were 50,000 truckers who had registered to come. There was— How many exhibitors do you think were there?

Carlton Riffel 2:11
I don’t know the actual numbers but, if their booth things meant anything, there had to be a few 1,000.

Adam Vazquez 2:18
Few 1,000. Yeah, that tracks with how big everything was. And the entire point of the show is to provide new solutions, new opportunities, new jobs, new products for truckers themselves. So it wasn’t necessarily a supply chain show broadly but specific to trucking. It’s one of the biggest (or the biggest) show.

We had a client there and so we got media passes, which is great. Thank you to the Mid-America Trucking Show for allowing us to have those. We were there for a couple of reasons: (1) we were helping our clients, supporting our client Oakley Trucking. Thank you again to all of them who allowed us to tag along. We also made and are making a short—I don’t know what you’d call it—just kind of a short YouTube video on the future of the driving experience.

Carlton Riffel 3:01
A vignette.

Adam Vazquez 3:09
A vignette. And had a lot of really great conversations with different companies in the space about that, around that. We’ll talk about that. And then (2) we were there just kind of observing and seeing what there was to see. Lay the context for the people, a couple of highlights contextually of what you saw last week.

Carlton Riffel 3:33
First of all, I should have come prepared for this interview and wore my fake mullet.

Adam Vazquez 3:37
That’s why I have this on.

Carlton Riffel 3:38
It was the land of the mullets, man.

Adam Vazquez 3:42
Big time.

Carlton Riffel 3:44
Yeah, if there’s like another acronym for MATS, I feel like we could come up with something good. So yeah, it was a trucker show focused on truck—

Adam Vazquez 3:52
Mullets At The Show. Sorry.

Carlton Riffel 3:52
There you go. That’s it right there. Mullets At The Show. Nice and simple.

We basically, in talking to people, figured out that the trucking industry in and of itself has a lot of hardware components to it. Because you’re driving a truck and then increasingly there are a lot more software components. So you go by these booths. And sometimes the services are obvious (what they did), whether it was they got the grill for the truck and this is a booth that specializes in grills, or you could see some screens up and it was kind of clear from other booths that they were technology booths, or that they had something to do with services specific to the driver industry. So yeah, as far as the entire show goes, there was a very large variety of different types of vendors there.

As far as truckers go, I think what they were looking to get, a lot of them, in talking to these different people, there was the industries or the companies that were looking to attract drivers. You can tell solely looking to attract maybe the company that would employ the driver. So maybe not necessarily owner-operators, but companies like Oakley or like Norton. So you’ve got this huge mixed bag of different levels of the trucking industry, I guess you’d say, different roles within that. And so it was super interesting for us to just be able to talk to these different people and really walk away getting pretty much a similar synopsis from everyone. And that was really that the trucking industry at large is going through a ton of change right now. Drivers have the leverage. They’ve got the negotiating leverage because of the shortage right now. And so that’s a big concern that everyone is focused on is finding drivers.

Adam Vazquez 4:47
The workforce shortage, to be clear.

Carlton Riffel 4:54
Yeah, the workforce shortage, so drivers, people trying to hire left and right. Within that, though, I think we kind of walked away thinking and understanding that there’s a little bit of a gap between where technology is going and where the trucking industry is going for drivers.

Adam Vazquez 5:52
Front loading, to what you just said, it’s the same problems. Some people who might be listening to this who maybe are part of the industry are like, well, actually, we’re coming out of that shortage, to the point where I think the spot markets are down right now, trucking companies are having to take loads that they wouldn’t have taken six, nine, 12, 18 months ago. So the market is sort of changing. But when it comes to the actual talent, the workforce, just like blue-collar jobs all across America, truckers, maybe more so and this has been the news, this is not novel it to anyone, but there’s a huge shortage there. And they can kind of dictate their own terms and it’s this weird balancing act. I want to get to the problems in a second. Just a few things about truckers, if you’re not familiar with truckers, probably most of you are. There are a few things that I think are unique about them that are worth noting. So one, first of all, it is still considered very much a blue-collar job, right? You can go into trucking with or without any type of really formal education. I met lots of truckers who the height of their education was a GED or a high school diploma. And they’re doing great. Like they’re making over $300,000. They’re taking home, whatever 250 of that they’re making more money than they ever had before. So that’s a unique thing, I would say to trucking where the education level doesn’t necessarily have to be as high as other industries to have that earning potential. And that earning potential is real. The other thing is that there is a and this is from you, I learned this Carlton or notice this, there’s just a general mistrust because of what’s going on in the last 12 To 18 to 24 months in really just entirely across the country. But specifically as it relates to truckers. And you could feel that I just in conversations in talking to both the vendors and the truckers, there’s a sense of a little bit of a sense of mistrust on behalf of the truckers of like, I have to take care of myself, no one else is going to look out for me. And everyone’s in fact out probably out to get me the reason that they believe that all the other like geopolitical stuff aside, is because of this sort of elephant in the room that’s hanging out behind everyone’s head that is driverless technology and driverless trucking, having driver Japonais drivers, right robot drivers, whatever. And funnily enough— Funnily? I don’t know if that’s a word. Funnel cakes enough, that came out with a bunch of vendors who were more… I’d be curious to get your take on that but, before we get into the full end problems, just laying the landscape for people, I thought there were some vendors there and some people who were just there as part of the “not truckers” part of the crowd, who were a lot more light about that. Like, “Yeah, we got to get these guys to work with us or to do this or blah, blah, blah at least until we get to replace them with robots.” That was a pretty common refrain. And it’s like, well, no wonder they hate crypto because there’s a divide. Did you notice that?

Carlton Riffel 9:32
Yeah, absolutely. It almost feels, when you’re there, like a class divide, but really it’s just lifestyle. It’s a difference in what people have is their ideals. I think from the technology perspective, a lot of these drivers are some of the drivers view the technology that they have to do as a burden. It’s like, Oh, I’ve got to do that thing, and I’ve got to do this thing and I’ve got to have This app and that app, I think a lot of them gladly will adopt technology that helps them. But I think the most recent changes in the driving industry, for the most part have been things that have limited or hindered what they can do, instead of enabling them.

Adam Vazquez 10:18
Give us an example from something you saw.

Carlton Riffel 10:22
Like an example with their logs. That’s been something that’s not super recent. But you’ve got basically these computers inside trucks now that are, are monitoring everything. They physically can’t drive their truck longer than a certain amount of time before it’s registered, so that’s one aspect of it. And I think the other aspect of it is that you have, you’ve got different companies that are trying to get their foot in the door with their technology and trying to optimize things for them. And the trucker is just one part of that. And so one thing that I kept looking for was, which companies or how are companies trying to bring those different things together, those different pieces of technology to actually make it easier on the driver, instead of one more thing that the driver has to keep track over one more app that they have to download? And to be honest, we didn’t talk to every single person there. But I didn’t see as much of that as I thought.

Adam Vazquez 11:23
What you’re talking about there is like, to relate it to technology, is like the who’s building the APIs?

Carlton Riffel 11:29
Absolutely, yeah. Who’s building the connections? So that things will work together? seamlessly? You see it a lot in different industries. It’s not only the trucking vertical, but you see it where people will try— it’s silos. They try to build it all. They try to basically have their own ecosystem, with everything in it. And, and so I think it’ll be interesting to see where things go, as far as data being shared, as far as platforms working with each other in a way that helps not just the driver, but also the companies that are deploying the technology.

Adam Vazquez 12:06
Yeah. Okay, so just to recap, I think we laid out four problems there. The first is kind of general driver mistrust. And I think totally three problems maybe ’cause that goes along with, there’s a view of drivers as a commodity by the other side. These are not right or wrong. I’m just stating what we saw. The second is, like you just mentioned, like a lot of there’s a lot of investment being poured into this, obviously. But they’re all everyone’s fighting their own battle independently. And there’s doesn’t seem to be a ton of cross-collaboration. And of course, this is our view from the trade show floor, right? Like we’re not privy to what’s going on behind doors, but that’s what it seems like. And the next one I would say is, there seems to be a lot of short-term thinking when it comes to like driver engagement. And whatever we offer value we can give to drivers.

What I mean by that is this, we were there with Oakley Trucking who is the antithesis of this and who just been standing there and seeing the conversations they were having. The fact that it seems so not novel to these drivers that Oakley has had people with them who have been there for 10 or 15 years, and we’ve been taken care of by the company, and like, drivers were blown away by that. But we kept meeting driver after driver who had actually experienced that. And, to me, it was like, I wonder why that is because they do it there. And then we walked around and there’s even a part of the trade show floor called the Shark Tank. And that’s what everyone refers to it as. And it’s just like if you’ve watched like a Wall Street movie or something like that, and there’s like a trading floor and everyone’s just yelling and boba. That’s kind of the feel you get by like on a trucker trade show. Alright, so got everyone’s just walking through and people are just, like, hitting them upside the head with, Hey, come drive for this rate per mile, not even pretending to like have a value offer necessarily like Oakley did. So Oakley had a whole setup and did really well. But we’re talking about these other groups, that it was just like, here’s our table, here’s our card, do you want to sign up or not? And both from the driver’s point of view of like, just being bombarded with all these messages, and I guess opportunities, but also from like, the people who like people were accepting those opportunities and taking those jobs and etc. And it’s like, man, it just seems like such short-term thinking by both sides, instead of investing in maybe like a knowledge base or in things to help these folks over the next 15 years if there is a transition in the workforce. It wasn’t any of that. It was like Where can I get the 15 cents per mile? And that just struck me because it was so different than some of the other districts that we’ve experienced.

Carlton Riffel 15:01
An interesting thread to pull on there because, talking to some people, you get the sense that loyalty is everything, like some of these truckers that he talked to, it’s like, they are only going to drive for that one company. And that’s you can almost put them in their own category. As far as owner-operators go, you’ve got people that they’re an owner-operator, and they’re on the other side of the spectrum where they are just going to move companies for the 15 cent increase, or whatever it is. And you’re talking about that commoditization element, it’s, it’s almost like some of these truckers, they want to see as many options as they can to be able to pick the best one. And I think what we’re talking about is when you’re trying to attract drivers to actually stick with your company, from the company’s perspective, you need to do things that are more than just commoditizing them, you need to build the relationship and make it so that there is shared trust there and shared experiences around a knowledge base, like you were saying, Adam, or, or something similar to that, whether that’s a company party or there could be a bunch of different factors.

Adam Vazquez 16:08
Content’s a big part of that.

Carlton Riffel 16:10
Absolutely.

Adam Vazquez 16:12
This is not like a “paid for by Oakley,” but they just do it so well that I feel like I need to reference them. So Oakley Trucking, customer of ours, produces The Oakley Trucking Podcast. That is a podcast targeted to 800 people, the 800 owner-operators who worked for Oakley. First of all, we know the numbers, so we know a lot more people are listening to it than their intended audience, but also, we kept seeing different people who would just walk up who have never worked with Oakley or some who weren’t drivers but who listened to the show and were like, “Wow, you all do something different” or “You all really have changed the way I think about X, Y, Z in my business.” We met one family who rents a truck but the father and daughter and wife were there and they just wanted to say, “Hey, Jeremy,” because it’s a part of their almost regular content diet. And I think that that’s a cool example of very long-term thinking. But that was the minority for the most part.

Carlton Riffel 17:15
Yeah, I think we saw three podcast setups, right. Were there. There are people that were doing at the show, I’m sure more people in the just that habit. But as far as running it live at the event, because it’s a perfect opportunity to meet up with people that are already in your space, industry leaders with a lot of expertise. And I think what you said earlier was good at them. We’re not necessarily trucking and logistics experts, this is just our marketing lens kind of being applied over a three-day span and kind of observing what we noticed.

Adam Vazquez 17:49
Okay, so let’s flip it. I think that’s a good synopsis of the problems, mistrust, siloed solutions, a lot of short-term thinking when it comes to the driver experience. What are some of the solutions that either you saw or were interesting to you as we walked away from there or interesting to think about?

Carlton Riffel 18:10
Yeah, I think as far as technology goes, because that’s where my head mainly was just looking at what are the opportunities here? What are the biggest problems here? I do think like driver monitoring, and driver, I guess it’s like truck and driver monitoring, road monitoring. But that whole idea of having a camera, on cameras on the truck, or cameras in the cab to kind of keep track of everything is really interesting because you’ve got these computers that are inside the truck engine. They’re connected to the engine, they’re connected to the, basically to the road saying what’s happening there. But then adding another layer on top of it that’s like this camera on the road and camera in the cab, it seems a little bit big brother ish, right? So I was just kind of curious to see how different companies were trying to put their own spin on that. And one of the companies we talked to, basically use that to gamify. And to make things a little bit more of a carrot, as they say, instead of a stick, and try to entice these drivers to have improved driving, not just have better driving, but also do basically, some of the things that would make would help their company but also help the driver improve. And so there’s this green zone score, and they could get in that green zone score if they had so many miles that were incident-free. And so it just incentivize them to be better drivers. So I thought that was interesting from a technology perspective. Now, what about you, Adam? What did you think?

Adam Vazquez 19:42
Just on that, I think that was Netro 9. I mispronounced them before. Was that what they were called?

Carlton Riffel 19:47
Netradyne.

Adam Vazquez 19:48
Netradyne. I think the other thing that I really liked about them was—that’s another great example of the really long term focus—they have a whole portal of educational content where they’re trying to actually improve the driver as a driver, not necessarily just as a meat body that will soon be replaced by a robot. That’s a good example.

One that I think we saw that, being in full transparency, neither of us was impressed by the actual booth, but the idea is interesting. So we saw this one company, I don’t know remember what they’re called. After that intro, I wouldn’t say it anyways, but it was some type of virtual reality training company and the idea behind it was they were using the— What’s it called?

Carlton Riffel 20:41
Headset, yeah. VR headset.

Adam Vazquez 20:42
VR headset in order to… So theirs was remedial. So like, if a driver had done something wrong or had a mark against them, then you could come replicate that scenario using the VR goggles and try to help them out, try to train them to do better next time. I thought that was cool. I thought even better is like, putting drivers into like flight simulator school if you’re going through the process, and you maybe have driven some or have are about to start driving, putting them into some of the scenarios that they are just going to face, particularly like, by region with the trucking companies that we work with, their drivers tend to have a similar route or routes that they stick with. So like if you’re going to be going over the Rockies. Okay, well, that sets a certain set of challenges, if you’re going to be in the Northeast during the winter. In the snow, hurricane, whatever. Heavy wind. You’re going to deal with a certain set of circumstances by your geography. So anyway, they weren’t doing that, but that’s just where my head went: very personalized, very specific training. Because the VR stuff is really, really cool and I think it could be applied to help proactively give and fill up the driver as opposed to just like, the short term thinking, but I thought I thought that was one and then the other one, and we did an interview with them with a group. I don’t know if you have the name there. But the other one that just really stuck out to me, and this is just like a problem. I know this much bigger problem than anything we can solve definitely on a podcast. But with Jason, yeah, just with content, but the problem of driver health and the huge opportunity for technology solutions there when we talk about driver experience like they are human beings who are sitting for 10, 12, 14 hours a day. We were told this week the average lifespan of a driver is 57. That’s insane.

Carlton Riffel 22:50
I understood that as the actual lifespan. Do you think that was the career span?

Adam Vazquez 22:56
Now that would be crazy because that would be way longer than any other career span. I’m pretty sure that was biological lifespan.

Carlton Riffel 23:04
Yeah, I know he said 57, but I was like, oh, my word. That’s insane if that’s the case, but I would almost believe it with some of the things that we saw.

Adam Vazquez 23:15
Yeah, it was really sad to see. And not by no fault of the driver, right? Like you and I were in that arena for three days. We weren’t even in a truck the entire time. And we made the worst food choices, because that’s where we were. I came home feeling terrible. So I think there’s a lot of education that needs to go on there. I wish there was some enablement and health enablement, like, simple truckers, drivers, specific workout apps and workout videos that can help them use the equipment that is around them organically, to make better decisions, or to be able to get your heart rate up or, I’m talking about in a very rudimentary way, but that was like something that like slapped me in the face.

Carlton Riffel 24:02
Yeah, it was the one company called Healthy Trucking or Truckee Healthing. Healthy Trucking, and they were a nonprofit. They’re working with the CDC. It was interesting to see some of their initiatives because they were literally giving away tons of resources and tests and different things but, for that particular agency, it goes back to that trust thing. There’s this air of mistrust for certain agencies or certain—

Adam Vazquez 24:41
Yeah, government entities, specifically with the trucker audience.

Carlton Riffel 24:45
So, yeah, I think that’s a problem to be solved. And like you said, we can’t just solve it with content, but I think content can play a role in informing. We did see the yoga. There was like two yoga—

Adam Vazquez 24:57
Oh, yeah, you’re right. I forgot about that one.

Carlton Riffel 25:00
So there was some there, but I think that’s a big— It’s an opportunity until it’s a solved problem, so it’s a space that could definitely use a lot of attention. For us, being involved with Dynamo and some of these other companies in the trucking space or in the logistics space where we get to see some of the advanced “future of trucking,” “future supply chain.” I think we’re exposed to some solutions that are pretty far in advance. But there’s this gap between maybe the next five and 10 years where there’s definitely going to still be a person in the truck. And they’re definitely going to still have some of the challenges that we’re dealing with today. Where I think it’s valid for companies to be solving for those two. And we saw a lot of that at the trucking show. It’s just hard to know, how many of these, how many of these companies are supported just by the driver themselves? This owner-operator and how many can that how many companies can this owner-operator afford to pay? And if their choice is between leveraging a couple more getting a little bit more money out of whatever route, they’re taking verse spending a bunch of money on a health solution, they’re probably going to take out that money. So it’s just something to think about. How can you integrate that problem with another solution that may be solves multiple problems at once?

Adam Vazquez 26:25
I would say, maybe moving from those solutions to maybe some broader takeaways, I think what you just were talking about is probably the first one for me is that, yes, we don’t have all the looks under the veil. But if you just take the temperature of what we just saw, we saw over 1,000 exhibitors, I think it’s very safe to say we saw 50,000 Plus attendees, you just take the temperature of the room, it felt the driver experience. Now I’m on the entire industry with the driver experience feels super antiquated. I think that’s just fair to say, there’s plenty of room for innovation and plenty of room for where content can play a role in enabling these people. That’s just a broad thing that I think is true.

The second thing I’d say is that I think most of the problems and solutions that we’re kind of talking about now can also be extrapolated. I’m thinking of some of our listeners who aren’t in the trucking business but do have blue-collar or whatever you wanna call it, “sweaty startup” type employees. I think these are probably a similar problem set for— Why are you laughing at me? What?

Carlton Riffel 27:35
I just, the sweaty startup. Unless you know the sweaty startup guy, it probably sounds like an insult.

Adam Vazquez 27:41
Oh, “sweaty startup” just means that you are doing something that’s— you’re not sitting at a computer all day.

Carlton Riffel 27:46
Hard work.

Adam Vazquez 27:48
I’m thinking of Sully. These are the same problem sets across those industries. The difference is—and this is why trucking is so intriguing (and this is my opportunistic sense now)—is that not all of those industries are people pulling down $270-300,000. This unique area where the driver experience, they have capital to spend, especially on— Just human nature, when you start to make money, what do you do with that money? Maslow’s hierarchy, right? You solve for what you need and then as your needs change, you change with. So I think that is a huge market opportunity to help drivers sort of nudge their way up Maslow’s hierarchy. I mean that in the most positive way. I probably sound super capitalistic, but I mean that in the most positive way of making their lives better so they’re not making $300,000 but eating sodium and plastic until they pass away in their mid-50s. That is crazy to me.

Carlton Riffel 29:00
I think another takeaway is that the speaking back to the trust element, there’s, I think there’s a certain amount of money or advertising that gets put into trying to, like almost like whitewash some of the negatives of some of these programs or some of these companies. And I think a lot of truckers see right through that. Like, like, you try to make it look pretty or try to do something so it doesn’t seem so much like Big Brother watching your—

Adam Vazquez 29:32
Oh, yeah. Just be transparent with what you’re saying.

Carlton Riffel 29:36
Yeah, so I think there’s something to be said for being transparent and I love how what Netradyne said about this, because until you give them the ability to see the exact same data that that company sees that that trucking business sees, and until you give them the opportunity to make comments or to give feedback on that, then you don’t have the trust. I think that those things go hand in hand. So it’s interesting to see like, how can you take an industry that has some of those, those leanings towards or tend to be less technological, tech technologically inclined, and give them the resources and give them the opportunities to use that technology but in a transparent way, and not make it just so it’s like, well, this is happening above your head or over your head. But this is something that if you can help us with or if you can partake in or you can participate in, then it will help us both.

Adam Vazquez 30:35
Yeah, I think that totally speaks to the commoditization again. Like, oh, these drivers will just do what we think and it’s just completely misunderstanding who your audience is. Totally agree with you.

Carlton Riffel 30:47
So I think that’s my big takeaway. Hopefully that’s not too abstract, but it’s definitely something you could experience and see when you were there.

Adam Vazquez 30:55
Yeah. Well, all in all, really enjoyed the trip, enjoyed the conference. I think it’s something that we’ll probably end up doing again and again just because we learned so much, we were able to make some great connections. One story maybe to wrap up this—

Carlton Riffel 31:09
The highlight of Adam’s trip.

Adam Vazquez 31:12
No, it was terrible. I’ve already told you. I was kind of sick. I was trying to tough through it or whatever. We’re driving down to dinner, Carlton and I. I’m driving in my vehicle. Carlton would say I’m probably a little bit obsessive, but I am pretty particular when it comes to my vehicle. So like, if there’s a chance to park further and have no one be close to me so that I don’t—

Carlton Riffel 31:36
We’re literally walking for like 30 minutes ’cause Adam didn’t want to park within a mile of another car. We’re gonna go into a restaurant and he’s like, “No, I can’t. This is far too close to another car.”

Adam Vazquez 31:48
I was looking out for our health per our trucking conversation we just had. But anyway, I am particular about it and maybe that’s what it was, just like idolatry that was being punished, but we’re driving down towards downtown and I see this man gesturing on the side of the road. We passed him and then all sudden, I heard a huge BOOM and Carlton’s like, “Woah, that guy just threw something at us.” And I was like, “What!?” I pull over. This man had thrown some type of— We still don’t know what it was. Like a cement—

Carlton Riffel 32:23
Yeah, the jury’s out on this one.

Adam Vazquez 32:24
—mudball of some kind.

Carlton Riffel 32:26
Like a sand residue on the side of your truck and it was lightly scratched but it was soft enough that I saw something kind of explode in the corner of my mirror.

Adam Vazquez 32:39
And also, it didn’t dent the truck like a rock would have or something like that. Anyway, I was obsessed with it. I checked that spot probably 10 times that evening and the next day. Did get it home, did get it cleaned up. For the most part, it’s gone. There are some remaining scratches that I’ll never be happy about, but that was our welcome to Louisville, so if anyone from Louisville is listening, I hope you go out of your way to make this right in the future. This needs to be justified and rectified. You can take us out to dinner, you could do something to make this right in the future. But I would say that is the one thing I will definitely take away in addition to all the great conversations and connections that we had. Yeah, it was a really good trip.

Carlton Riffel 33:25
If anybody has any suggestions about what they think that could have been. Sandy residue but it was loud enough that it had to have some mass to it.

Adam Vazquez 33:35
It was super loud but it was gone. You didn’t see anything on the ground, right?

Carlton Riffel 33:39
No, there was nothing. My first thought was like, oh, there’s got to be a thing bouncing down the road that you chucked. Like an ice ball or something. And it was what? In the 40s? So it couldn’t have been—

Adam Vazquez 33:52
There was no snow anywhere. Anyway, it’s a mystery. But with that, Carlton, thank you for spending your time with us up there in Louisville. Thanks for all the work that you did. Hopefully this will be helpful. We should say we’re also working on that video about the future of the driving service and that’s gonna be pretty cool. We have some companies like we talked about, like Netradyne. We have a bunch of other companies that are going to be featured in it, so that’ll be coming in the next month or so. We’ll obviously push that out. But yeah, anything else before we take off?

Carlton Riffel 34:24
I think that’s it.

Adam Vazquez 34:26
Alright, we’ll catch you guys next week.

Carlton Riffel 34:28
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